Killing a dead lion: The resurrection of Jesus


Blessed are the doubters: for they shall not be easily fooled.”
― Aniekee Tochukwu

Thanks to Gary, he shared this link on a thread where some of you might not see it. It is a good read worth your while.

Did Jesus resurrect

 

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About makagutu

As Onyango Makagutu I am Kenyan, as far as I am a man, I am a citizen of the world

48 thoughts on “Killing a dead lion: The resurrection of Jesus

  1. Arkenaten says:

    Just read it. Excellent. I had read of the significance of the lamb sometime ago but this was well argued, and so simple to understand, and the more one comes across such arguments the more the feeling that it is a complete fiction from beginning to end.

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    • makagutu says:

      It is a simple read.
      Unklee and his scholars’ consensus might still find room to believe.

      Like

      • Arkenaten says:

        The standard argument is the Traffic Accident analogy Singer uses.
        It is similar to the one Habermas, among others, uses.
        It’s funny, after reading the article I sat and tested my own memory.
        Less that twenty years ago I took my kids to see the Rolling Stones when they played Jo’berg and I;ll be damned if I can remember much detail other than one or two moments and the nice feeling it brings back.
        Is it possible such large volumes of work could have been composed by ”eyewitnesses” or even second or third hand accounts?
        No chance.
        The writer of Mark wrote his and the others simply copied and embellished.

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  2. Nice piece. Thanks for the link. It is a well written argument. Jeebus and his zombiefaction are fictions, I do believe.

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  3. shelldigger says:

    Note to future religion inventors: Do not create such a convoluted, discrepency ridden account of your religions beginnings. Get together beforehand and set the facts…err claims in stone. Everbody get on the same page first, then tell your story… err lies. That way no one can backtrail your story, I’m sorry- lies, and see the scam. Oh also try sprinkling in some common well known facts that might lend credence to your story, damn it- lies. You know stuff like drink milk to make you grow big and strong, or wash your hands after you wipe your ass, or rats carry the plague, not demons. You need some sort of believeability right from the start, to keep assholes like us from showing how fucking stupid you religion really is.

    Geez people are stupid.

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    • makagutu says:

      Oh my shelldigger friend, your advice has come quite late for Mormons, Muslims, Christians, Jews and many more but I hope those who intend to invent a religion in the future will follow your advice

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      • shelldigger says:

        Maybe they figured if they were pious enough, and angry enough when questioned about their inconsistencies, that everyone would simply lend them the airs of legitimacy.

        While that does seem to work, it still seems silly to start off by drilling so many damn holes in their boats. Though it is kind of funny watching them try to plug them.

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        • makagutu says:

          Maybe they never saw any holes.
          Do you think Ellen G. White saw any holes in her composition?

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          • shelldigger says:

            Good point. I’ll admit I had to go read up on Ellen White. (damn you Mak!) My initial response would be, I think that rock thumped her on the head pretty good. 🙂 May have been some lasting damage there…

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          • makagutu says:

            I apologise my friend 🙂
            I will start charging you a small fee.
            It must have been a brick launched the night using some mechanical device

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          • shelldigger says:

            Oh, so now I’m getting charged for being forced to go Google stuff and read up on it. I suppose the internet has won. lol

            I really didn’t see anything profound in her supposed visions. I guess you have to be wearing the babble glasses to get it. I seem to have misplaced mine.

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          • makagutu says:

            And she has followers! You can from that tell how uncritical people generally are.
            The Internet is winning

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          • Brian M says:

            wow! Just rode my bicycle right by her estate last week! THAT is why there are so many Adventists in St. Helena, CA

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          • makagutu says:

            There are many Adventists here too. Strange things happen I tell you.
            To confound matters, I have even seen first scientist church in Nairobi

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    • L. Ron Hubbard tried this with Scientology. Don’t know if it worked, as that “religion” is too scary for me to even bother looking into. Its followers redefine the words “whack-jobs.”

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      • makagutu says:

        I have not ventured to find out about Scientology. Life is short and Christianity has enough crazy to occupy several lifetimes

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        • fojap says:

          That’s what my mother said when we watched a documentary about it. Maybe it’s because I wasn’t brought up in a religions, but to me they’re all the same. I don’t worry about the details of Christianity. You talk about the details and I’m still stuck on the god part.

          Though it is funny, when you stop and think about it. All the more “sophisticated” believers like to say that all of the details are symbolic or metaphorical and their god is this big abstract thing. Yet every religion has crazy stories. None ever really seem to stop with, “Well, there’s this big abstract loving thingamabob that unites all of us, but I can’t tell you much more because we don’t understand it.” No, they always want something more than that. First, it’s the crazy stories. Then, for some reason, it always comes down to what you can eat and who you can fuck. Strange, that.

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          • makagutu says:

            It is strange, my dear friend, what believers really want. It is impossible to reconcile an abstract being and its concerns about who fucks who and eats what. That most people die without finding there was something wrong with this belief is, in my view, an injustice to them

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          • And none of them ever simply toss out the bible. Oh, they’ll claim it isn’t literal, and it’s just stories, but they all still pretty much cling to and read from the book. When your holy book, literally believed or not, is filled with homicide, genocide, prejudice, and endorsed slavery by the “god” in it, it’s time to toss out the fucking book. “Oh, but there are nice parts, too,” they’ll say. Then tear those out. Stick em in a new book, and toss out the disgusting shit. Little respect for these folks, have I. I’ve more for fundies who don’t try to wiggle out of the fact their book and their god are hate-filled and ugly as shit. They embrace it and live their lives accordingly-like a-holes, but at least they’re honest a-holes. $Amen$

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          • makagutu says:

            There are NT Christians but then they still tell you sin came to the world through Adam. Why do they want to have it both ways?

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      • shelldigger says:

        That is quite the package of assorted nuts. 🙂

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  4. fojap says:

    That epigram needs to be put on a button.

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  5. Nice read. If Christianity has taught me anything, it’s to be critical.

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  6. Peter says:

    Mak, that is an excellent article. It is interesting to read the Jewish perspective as distinct from the Christian presentation of the Jewish perspective.

    A few years back when I was studying the New Testament at Seminary I was especially struck by the Book of Acts. Because it occurred to me that one of the major themes in that book was to seek to explain why the majority of Jews rejected Jesus as the Messiah. This article presents a good counterbalance.

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    • makagutu says:

      Hi Peter,
      In your studies of Acts, what was the judgement on its authenticity?

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      • Peter says:

        At the time I studied, I assumed Acts was absolutely authentic. My seminary did not explore the critical theories on Acts. So after studying Acts I still considered it a historical work. However after studying Acts (and other parts of the Bible) I built up a list of queries (issues) that kept increasing until in recent months the dam wall burst.

        When I studied Acts I was confused by things like James quoting the LXX version of Amos in Chapter 15 at the perhaps most crucial decision made by the early church. It would not have been so critical if not for the fact that the Hebrew version of that part of Amos had quite a different meaning. This puzzled me and was one of those little drips that over time can wear down a mountain.

        When I studying in seminary I tended to avoid the critical scholars as I knew they were works of the Devil! This is why I can appreciate how Christians don’t even want to hear the arguments, As I was once like that myself.

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        • makagutu says:

          Thanks very much, Peter.
          Your comment on the quotations from Amos are much in line with a book am currently reading on the Acts. And the conclusion of the author is that the author is unknown but most of it is the composition of one person who was more likely a sympathizer with the Apostle of the Gentiles than with those of the circumcision.

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  7. exrelayman says:

    Here’s the beautiful irony: nobody is better than pointing out the silliness of a particular religion than sincere devotees of another religion. Here is something I saw years ago on the web by an anonymous commenter: Mythology is someone else’s religion, sufficiently different from your own for its silliness to be obvious.

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    • makagutu says:

      In deed. My own deconversion was sped up by reading literature by Muslims on Christianity and luckily for me, I at the same time applied their reasoning to Islam.

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      • Brian M says:

        I read an amazing screed by a hard core fundie Christian pointing out how scary and febrile Islam’s founding mythos is. THIS person, through the lens of hard core Fundie Christianity, made a rather “convincing” (in a mythological way) case that Muhammad had been deceived by demons.

        Wish I could find it, as it is amazing (and a bit funny for an outsider)

        Like

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