Between consciousness and unconsciousness, which is the more abundant?
A simple question or open thread
Random thoughts
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Between consciousness and unconsciousness, which is the more abundant?
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Good question…
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The answers have been more than interesting. You can’t imagine such a simple question can bring such a long debate
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I guess it’s all down to people’s perspectives.
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I think so too
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In what context do you ask your question. For I know there are two varying definition of both……one a noun and the other an adjective.
Where they are both Nouns……they they complement each other in abundance.
Where they are both adjectives ….then , well…..we are more conscious than unconscious. ….not so, or unless you are comatose ……
More clarity ……..?
Nqs
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Why are you making such a simple question hard.
I meant this
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Been spending too much time wondering how conscious Deepak Chopra is?
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Is Deepak conscious? Here is a random bs generator, I hear
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I’ve no idea. Haven’t really been fully conscious since, oh, 1987, I believe. Mushrooms will do that to you. Wait? Is this question part of the conscious or unconscious mind? Am I really reading it, or do I just think I am? Are you real, or are you just a bug in my computer asking questions within my subconscious? Can we be conscious if we lack a subconscious mind? Where are these things located? In our brains or our legs? How do we know this? Is our conscious mind just a projection of our unconscious mind and thus we’re always unconscious and only dreaming we’re not? Is it as warm in the forest as it is in the summer?
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No, this question is as simple as the post. No complex philosophizing.
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Where’s the fun in that?
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None at all.
You lost me in all your complex questions
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Sorry. I’m a philosopher. I can’t answer simple questions. If we could do that, we’d put a huge dent in philosophy departments in every university around the globe. Apologies.
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I am quitting philosophy. I want to start looking for real answers
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Neuroscience. Get Victoria on the thread. She’ll have a great answer.
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I think that idjit David has kept her very busy. I miss her ๐ฆ
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If you are talking about David theology David then I agree with the adjective “idjit” as the perfect description for him ๐
He’s also captain evader- he can’t answer a simple question and (in relation to this post) remains in a perpetual state of intellectual unconsciousness ๐ lol
He bombarded me with his personal theology on my blog and I asked a question of which I apparently rendered him speechless
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hey Linden, hope you have been well.
I think I first saw his comments on Luke’s blog and he gets into a deeper hole with every subsequent comment
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Hey Mak! I have been well thank you and hope you have been also! ๐ yeah David is out of control. My Dad “retired” from blogging on that site because trolling was hard to manage on that site and he said his inbox got full just from those notifications alone! He said he tried to ignore it and then the fundie friends started blowing up his blog at all angles and he was like- I’m done lol.
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If I had to deal with fundies daily, I would take a break from blogging too. They are the most annoying lot and for every question you ask, they have a bible verse.
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Yeah I can’t say I don’t blame him either- luckily I found a community on here where I can be free thinking and speaking- that’s why I haven’t hung up the blogging hat yet ๐๐ its therapy for living in a fundie world lol
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I don’t know how a fundie survives online with all the information available that punctures holes in everything religious.
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Yeah and even if they are religious that’s no problem to me as long as they don’t try to cram it down my throat or damn me to hell for not thinking like them lol we should all be free to think as we please ๐๐
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You can always tell any such person to take a rope
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I’d say he’s operating in a total state of unconsciousness. David’s unaware there’s a real world out here that’s quite different than the fantasy world he lives in in his head.
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Haha. You are right
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I know- and try living in a state where his state of mind is the “norm” ๐ณ lol
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Ugh!
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He has. He’s quite the idjit. Not quite as much the idjit as Romeo, however. Hopefully Romeo will return at some point and share his wisdom with us some more. Brilliant fellow, he is.
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No no. I don’t want Romeo back. He needs help
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Yes. You’re right about that.
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He is not even fun to argue with. I sympathise with him
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Very true.
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Can the subconscious be creative? If so, then it’s clearly the more abundant.
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Subconscious can be creative.
Does unconscious and subconscious have the same meaning?
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I don’t know, do they? Are we even sure the subconscious exists?
I don’t know much about this subject.
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I’m pretty sure there are neuroscience studies done on this as I remember watching Sam Harris talk about it in a video. Of course, I can’t find the video now, but I think this question is very suited for the neuroscientist which, of course, I’m not one. Astrophysics and advanced organic chemistry I’m brilliant in, however. ๐
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Who would have known that apart from being so brilliant in literature, you would know chemistry too ๐
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Like the back of my hand. ๐
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Inspired is also finishing our holy book. He is an accomplished writer and noble prize winner too. /nod I swear it’s true on the Christian gods life!
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Thank you for your kind, true words, Sister Michelle.
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I’d swear this is true on the life of the gods
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Impressive.
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LOL!
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VICTORIA!!!! Can you hear us!? We need your input!
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Where is she?
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This is quite a good article on the subject
http://www.quora.com/Is-there-such-a-thing-as-the-subconscious
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Ah, I like the first comment:
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Interesting comment. I only skimmed through the article. Will read it later
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He (the commenter) says he’s a Computational Neuroscientist, whatever that actually means.
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It means he made it up cause it sounds nice. I’m a theoretical neuroscientist. In theory, if I could be whatever I wanted to be when I grew up, I’d be a neuroscientist. Now, I just say whatever the fuck pops into my head. Thus, theoretically, I often have no fucking idea what I’m talking about. $Amen$
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I’d be an Artiface Neuroscientist. In other words fraud. But I can say my brain has been studied a lot does that count?
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Yeah. It does. You’re a Sister of the One True Lady God, so whatever you say is true because, well, because you said it is. ๐
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Like wise brother. Amen and may the goddess bless you with a kiss from her lips (both sets). Amen!
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She’s the bestest goddess EVER!
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That counts
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B’wahahaha, I’m down with that
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Awesome. BTW, I passed by the philosophy section of a book store yesterday and decided, though I haven’t read them, that all the books in it are stupid and their premises insulting to my religion. Just in case you’re wondering. God bless you, and have a nice day. ๐
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Hahahah! Every time I get into a bookshop in this city, I leave crestfallen. I never find any book I am looking for
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I love book stores. I was making a joke about the philosophy books. John has a few folks criticizing his book on his site, and I find that rather asinine because they haven’t read it. Crazy christians, tricks are for kids.
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Maybe they will never read it but will have opinion about the book.
Did I tell you of a christian who believed the bible is true but haven’t read it?
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That’s what I thought too.
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That actually means he has made it up.
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LOL ๐
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Terrific article! Now we’re talkin’!
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Sometimes. I found this on one site:
I’m not sure about the assertion that “subconscious” “signals that the writer lacks real expertise.” I was under the impression that there had been a change from using on to the other over time, although I can’t remember which.
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Interesting. And makes a lot of sense
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I would think that the answer rests in the definition of each of them. Lot of folk asleep at the wheel. Nonetheless, good question!
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Definitions definitions, that is where some questions die. I will look for a useful definition that can be agreed to for the purposes of this discussion
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You’ve made my point. There are too many dictionaries. Too many words. Too many definitions. And “we” all get lost in translation with our multiple opinions inside our own heads, using definitions made up of beliefs, sometimes using the dictionary to back us up and then who’s communicating with whom? Your question was thought provoking and honestly I could debate it from both sides depending on the position I took in any given moment. Once again, nice chatting with you and I hope you have a good weekend. ๐
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Have a pleasant weekend too my friend
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Unconsciousness since it is always there. Yet consciousness is not always present. ๐
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We are in agreement
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Sweet I like it when you’re right. ๐
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With guys like Romeo, it’s never present.
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ROFL soooo fucking true!!
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Simplest answer yet! Good job!
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๐
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The philosophical answer to your question is: yes.
The practical answer to your question is: I have no clue. I’m not a brain scientist, so I’m not going to make up an answer.
The religious answer to your question is: ZEUS LOVES YOU.
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We have a god and she is female. Zeus must be a subordinate.
Think about it just a little bit more. You may have an answer that for all practical purposes is as close to fact as we can get
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To answer the question, one would need to know what qualifies as conscious or not. If we don’t really have control over our faculties, it could be said that we’re unconscious the entire time (with the illusion of consciousness).
If we do have some control over ourselves, then we might have something called consciousness. At that point, the question becomes at what threshold of brain activity do we have this control? It has to be measurable, or there’s no way to test for it.
Then, one might end up finding that different people go through life with different amounts of consciousness.
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I know I usually ask complex questions. It appears if I ask what is 1+1? I will have a long philosophical debate.
Take the basic meaning of consciousness – to be aware and unconsciousness to be unaware and you will arrive at unconsciousness being the most abundant.
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1+1 ? What do you mean by “1”? Is the second 1 the same as the first? Is it colder in Canada than it is in the forest?
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Something like that.
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In high school calculus, my teacher informed us how to prove 1+1=2. Ever since then, I’ve not taken easy questions for granted.
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I know. Sometimes questions that are so simple could be so complex
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Aphrodite is the ONLY true god and she will smite you for naming Zues her sex toy boy above her… Repent, repent while you have time..
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I shall pray the prayer of enlightenment to find the TRUE deity.
Dear deity, please fill me with your wisdom. Make it hard for me to ignore the matter at hand. Moisten my lips so I can praise you. Whether you come quickly, or come after a while, I’d appreciate it if you came at all.
rAmen
We’ll see who answers this divine supplication.
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Over at walls site he has a donkey who witnessed the birth of Christ child..
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As Jeff would say — Hee Haw.
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Which site is this?
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Sorry it was “Man of one accord”
menofoneaccord.wordpress.com “pop-quiz”
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Talking about a donkey and a promise kept.
“Donkey Tells, A Promise Kept; is a story about a donkey named Sydney and her young colt Micah, with the Bibles account of Jesus entering Jerusalem on the donkey’s back. Unbeknownst to little Micah, he is the recipient of a promise made by God to his family long, long ago – and Micah is about to learn some very big and important lessons from a King. Although Micah’s story is a blend of fiction and non-fiction, it is filled with reiterated teachings of Jesus from the Gospels, facts from Jesus’ life and journey, and many more truths.”
Is the book summary.
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I’m writing a book about the holy ghost impregnating the virgin Mary from the point of view of a pubic lice that was living in her hooch at the time it happened. His name’s Byron The Crab, and it’ll be available around Christmas time. ๐
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WOW!
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“I hate crabs. They itch like a mother fucker.” The Virgin Mary, circa 1 week AD.
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Wait if ghosts fucked her she would not be a virgin.
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That’s what Byron’s been saying for 2000 years. And he should know. He was RIGHT there when it happened.
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So she got deflowered by a ghost, explains a lot
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She wasn’t a virgin. Who knows how long the ghosts had been fucking her. Think about it one ghost goes back and tells all his buddies you guys won’t believe this freaky chick I fucked her and she called me god and thanked me. The next night it’s an orgy.
I imagine the one who knocked her up got shit whacked for a while too. DUDE when we gonna find another freaky girl like that!
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Hahaha. Michelle you rock!
I am going to sleep now, but I will be laughing until I fall to unconsciousness
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Just because you can’t see the cock doesn’t mean it’s not a cock.
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“Just cause it’s invisible, doesn’t mean it’s not huge.” HG Wells, circa 1920
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Hahaha
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That will be such a long wait. Can we have excerpts before Christmas
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Sure thing.
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Just saw the ad for it. I had 2 thoughts:
1. Finally, someone admits a religious story involves talking out of one’s ass.
2. That summary is false. It involves fiction only.
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My ass gets talked to a lo5. Guys tend to like it.
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You own a donkey? What’s its name?
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Nah my ass isn’t hairy and ugly. Though it probably still stinks..
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Jeff would tell you they talk most out of their asses half the time
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Don’t tell me the donkey is one of the eyewitnesses
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he is, he is. He is the keeper of the promise!
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That donkey is a keeper.
Related to eyewitness donkeys. Who do you think ate that cock that we are told was out the night Jesus was arrested?
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I wonder if mary after the ghost orgies decided human men couldn’t satisfy her and fucked that donkey too?
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That doesn’t seem to me to be far fetched
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Hey she liked sleeping in barns.
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I like how you pray. Coming is important and especially for deities
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Here’s a video of Sam Harris talking about my favorite subject, Free Will. When you’ve time, watch it. He talks about the conscious and unconscious, or unaware, mind, and what we are and aren’t aware of from moment to moment as we go about the day making what we think are conscious decisions. It isn’t directly related to your question, but it is part of what he’s talking about. I find him fascinating. https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=645&v=k3sLbx7PrrQ
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Jeff, thanks for the video. I clicked on it and noticed that I had started watching this video a while back but I must have gotten distracted. YouTube now marks the videos you watched and if you haven’t watched it fully, it will start where you left off. So thanks for reminding me to finish this. ๐
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I thank you, and Sam Harris thanks you. Well, maybe he does. I don’t know him personally, so I really can’t say.
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Jeff, I hope to finish that Harris lecture sometime today, or over the weekend. Noel asked a simple question of a complex subject. ๐ This paper is probably the most comprehensive I’ve ever read on the subject. As the paper notes, a vast amount of data supports the proposition that much of mental life, including thoughts, feelings, and
motives, is unconscious/
Click to access BerlinTreatment.pdf
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Thanks for the link. Harris gets to this in the video. In regards to “free” conscious will, the question is, how free is it? Brain scans and studies show that microseconds before any conscious action we take, the brain has already decided what action to take based on its subconscious programming. Fascinating stuff. I think the only honest way to study these things is through neuroscience. We need to look at the physical organ, the brain, and see how it is reacting to stimuli around it. Eventually, if we’re persistent with this, we’ll understand the nature of consciousness and sentience at the neurological level. These topics have a lot of the “god of gaps” stuff that comes into play because we don’t yet know everything about them. These gaps, however, are shrinking and will eventually be no more.
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This is the truth about the brain
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Love that movie. Hilarious. Truth indeed.
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*snort*
I loved this scene. Brilliant. ๐
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John this is hilarious!
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I generally don’t like Woody Allen, but this was good, very good.
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It was well done
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I couldn’t agree more, Jeff. Now neuroscience has shown that the brain “sees” — makes decisions 5 to 10 seconds before we are consciously aware.
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn23367-brain-imaging-spots-our-abstract-choices-before-we-do.html#.VXsgAUaGNsU
I shared the studies with unkleE on Nate’s blog when he tried to convince us that his god warned him and saved his life, preventing him from being in an accident. Of course he tried to spin it.
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Harris talks about this in regards to free will. How free is a “will” when our brains determine our actions seconds before we enact them? Science is the way to go here. We don’t exist without a brain. So, if we want to understand what consciousness is, we must study the organ that creates it. The other option is to say “we” are somehow separate from our physical brains which there is not a shred of measurable evidence to support. Again, thanks for the link.
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It is impossible to talk of a we without the brain. The brain is both the faculty of knowing and what is knower
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I would be surprised if he didn’t spin it
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Nothing to add here. I agree totally
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I downloaded the file to read later. Thanks again.
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Downloaded the paper for later reading.
My questions are always simple.
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I’m the opposite: My simple is always ends up in a question.
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Oh buddy. You never cease to make me laugh. You are as funny as they get and short as they come
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$Amen$
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I like inspired. He is the right height. He can eat my pussy without getting on his knees. ๐ I can take him to a dance, toss the dress over him and no one will know except that I’m a screamer what’s happening.
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You make my days
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So you going to ghost fuck me tonight? I need a cock. ๐ฆ
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Just hold it there. Don’t move an inch.
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I’ll yell OH GOD and thank you when I am finally out of breath.
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And that will be because it is unbelievable how good it feels
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That’s the best idea I’ve heard in ages. Be happy to oblige you on it, my dear. ๐
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I knew that would please you
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Makes two of us
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I had started watching this video eons back but didn’t finish. I think it is because we agree so there was no need to finish it then
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He has such a calm way of presenting his ideas. I likes him.
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Yes he does, quite calm
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HURRAY! Victoria’s here.
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You guys rock! โค Made my day.
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We are a rock! We are an Aye, Aye, Aye-land! And a rock feels no pain, and an aye-land nev…ver, cries..
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Are you Scottish?
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No. But I wish I were. I was trying to write out in eye-dialect the Simon and Garfunkel song, I Am A Rock. I am part Irish, however, and I do a terrific Scottish brogue, especially when drunk.
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OIC now. ๐ Btw, I am half Scottish. The Stirling castle? My family tree. Half French-Canadian and half Scottish. Not too bad, Eh? Aye? ๐
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Aye, aye! Oh, I LOVE haggis, BTW. Don’t eat it cause I’m trying to lose weight and avoid a heart attack, but I loves it!
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OK — I know what haggis is made of (sheep heart, tongue and liver). Pass. ๐
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But it’s delicious. All fat and salt. Yummy.
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Ewwwwww
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Oh, and stomach — barf.
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I am glad
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Finally!
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Good one, my Nairobi brother. Given the recent behaviors by many of those haters in this country, I believe the “unconscious” to be the ones who are most abundant. Much love and many naked hugs! Have a fun and safe weekend! ๐
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You are right.
Bear hugs and a pleasant weekend
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I go with the unconscious being by far more abundant. Even forgetting involuntary things like breathing and keeping our heart beating, we’d never make it to breakfast if we had to think about everything we’re doing. Just standing upright involves all sorts of signals, the tactile information from our feet, the sense of balance from our inner ear, our sight tells us if we’re upright. We’re not consciously aware of any of that, and all we’ve consciously done at that point is to think, “Damn, it’s time to get up.”
Now, why is that last hour of sleep the most satisfying? I hate going to bed and I hate getting up. If I could only enjoy sleeping as much at the beginning as I do at the end.
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You are right about unconscious. Plus think about the things around you that are unconscious and the answer becomes too obvious.
I wish I could answer that about sleep
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I find that between concious and unconcious lies a state where my head is abuzz with all sorts of things from the day, then I reach unconcious. ๐
I think Michelle nailed it with “the unconcious always being there.”
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Yes. There are more stones than there are animals
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I shall come back to this post when I have more time and read all the interesting comments, so forgive me if I repeat a theory already proposed. Briefly – I think the subconscious is more prevalent, and the core of most creativity too. We just can’t measure it very accurately. A million seeds for our actions are likely to be born when dreaming. They mature in the soil of consciousness. The answer to the question cannot be entirely accurate either way…unless you are sonmi. Who is clearly right and knows all.
Probably.
– sonmi looking all-knowing upon the Cloud
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You are always welcome sonmi.
I like that about sonmi, by living in the clouds, she is always right
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