on Jesus Christ


In yesterday’s post or link, Superman was leading in the battle of the heroes. This quote from Ingersoll is a good addition to the debate

“Why should we place Christ at the top and summit of the human race? Was he kinder, more forgiving, more self-sacrificing than Buddha? Was he wiser, did he meet death with more perfect calmness, than Socrates? Was he more patient, more charitable, than Epictetus? Was he a greater philosopher, a deeper thinker, than Epicurus? In what respect was he the superior of Zoroaster? Was he gentler than Lao-tsze, more universal than Confucius? Were his ideas of human rights and duties superior to those of Zeno? Did he express grander truths than Cicero? Was his mind subtler than Spinoza’s? Was his brain equal to Kepler’s or Newton’s? Was he grander in death – a sublimer martyr than Bruno? Was he in intelligence, in the force and beauty of expression, in breadth and scope of thought, in wealth of illustration, in aptness of comparison, in knowledge of the human brain and heart, of all passions, hopes and fears, the equal of Shakespeare, the greatest of the human race?”

Col Robert Green Ingersoll, About the bible

About makagutu

As Onyango Makagutu I am Kenyan, as far as I am a man, I am a citizen of the world

49 thoughts on “on Jesus Christ

  1. One cannot compare the merits of a human being who has dedicated his or her life to the contemplation of the human condition! Every historical period demands new interpretations and sacrifices. The above claim is spurious. There are equally as many people holding Confucius or Socrates in the same regard.

    Liked by 2 people

  2. maryplumbago says:

    Love it. Great quote!

    Liked by 2 people

  3. 😍😍 Actually I would answer yes to all of Ingersoll’s qns.

    Like

    • makagutu says:

      And I think you would be mistaken

      Like

        • makagutu says:

          Care to explain

          Like

          • Let me take an example of the first two; Was he kinder, more forgiving, more self-sacrificing than Buddha? Yes, he was,he forgave those who put nails in his hands , he stopped to help everybody and as for s
            Self sacrifice , did Buddha live out his day, just one whole day for others , teaching when they followed Him , feeding them all in a place with no food , stopping his Journey to walk to a man’s house because he had come yelling I need help, most of our Great men never fully sacrifice themselves , they may sacrifice all their wealth , spend yrs in solitude seeking and lose so much for themselves but never really for others.

            Was he wiser, did he meet death with more perfect calmness, than Socrates? He died in the most cruel way humanity has come up with, hanging on the cross , many people died that way actually and most of the time you would hang in pain and bleeding for hours and hours , not like hanging where you could die in mins or fire etc , actually I have forgotten how Socrates died exactly, but I know Socrates wasn’t hanged and forgiving the people who are driving nails through your hands is pretty more calm and perfect for me. And Jesus was definitely wiser , but that you may not see my way. It’s just, he did something the entire world can do easily call dumb and meaningless and he successfully fulled the devil ,he won, I can’t say the same for Socrates and his wisdom, I mean where is he now, reading about him in our classes doesn’t exactly feel like winning for me.

            Liked by 1 person

            • And I can never equate his brain to anybody’s who has ever lived, I’m a Christian so I know He is God ,all wise . Nobody can rival him there.

              Liked by 1 person

              • makagutu says:

                How many gods do you believe in?

                Like

                • One God. But that doesn’t matter right now, if you wanna discredit Jesus being God ,that has nothing to do with anything, I really don’t wanna end up in a theology debate ,I was just giving my opinion, then realized it was a post by someone who didn’t believe in Christ and not someone who did and by then it was too late.

                  Like

                  • makagutu says:

                    You are going to first, Emilly.
                    You said Jesus is god. You have said you believe in one god. So i assume the only god you believe in is Jesus?

                    Like

                    • I would love to explain but please, not to a skeptic. You are either going to misunderstand what I say or still find fault with it. So neither you nor I will be benefiting really, so it’s nothing.

                      Like

            • Nan says:

              Of course the BIG difference is that there’s no proof that the deeds you listed were actually performed by an individual named “Jesus” — but there is verifiable evidence that the other folks you mentioned actually existed.

              Like

              • Wait, I got the other folks from the post actually. If you think Jesus Christ is mythical or unreal or a folk tale , you are in luck ,that changes so much for example, don’t put Him on your list of important people, I mean you might have to add Zeus or Krishna and who wants that.

                Like

                • makagutu says:

                  There is not sufficient evidence for the life of Jesus other than the biblical text and without proof of miracles (answering the challenge of Hume) the whole thing is a tall tale. Adding Krishna to the list doesn’t do you any justice.

                  Like

              • makagutu says:

                How can you doubt Jesus cursed a fig tree? Where is your faith, you heathen?

                Liked by 1 person

            • makagutu says:

              More forgiving? He had come to die for the sins of others so I hear, how had he envisaged doing this? Dying peacefully in his sleep eh? He is claimed to have began a riot in a synagogue.
              Buddha didn’t claim to be a god.
              He didn’t meet death calmly as Socrates. We are told he shouted asking the heavens why hath thou forsaken me & followed with take this from my hand or whatever.
              You have not shown an instant of his wisdom. Maybe when he cursed the fig tree or sent demons to a flock of hogs he showed his wisdom?

              Like

              • Sorry ,I’m in the wrong place, so very sorry. Good day though Makagutu.

                Like

                • makagutu says:

                  Good day, Emilly

                  Like

                • I really should not have tried to defend my faith here , I mean usually I’m up for the challenge, now I just feel like I tried to do it in the wrong place. Hope you meet an apologist who can gladly answer you some day. 🤓

                  Like

                  • makagutu says:

                    Haha. This is the best place. We don’t want An echo chamber, you see so opinion that disagree with us is highly welcome.
                    I hope you were not treated harshly 😀

                    Like

                    • Ofcourse I was treated well. If I give a different opinion, you ought to disagree ,I would do the same thing definitely. But I guess I prefer explaining to someone who wants to learn than someone who wants to judge or assess whether I’m telling the truth or not , or whether I’m smart or dumb or whether I’m sensible or not etc etc. Okay what am I even saying, productive Judgement is about us judging each other in a way, I guess I’m taking a break from that for a minute.

                      Like

                    • makagutu says:

                      Explaining to a person who believes as you do, in my view does not further the pursuit of knowledge. You see, for me, Christianity was taught to me as a child and presented as fact. I would want that the next generation is taught much better.

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • See, so I should be so glad I didn’t try so hard to explain to you what you already know. The rest is kinda none of my business, you see Christianity was meant to be simple but humans love complicating things. We share Christ and you do with the knowledge as you please. I’m glad you got a chance of rejecting Christ, a decision was made and to be alittle positive ,that is better than a lifetime of hypocrisy. Good luck on your new found path. Find me in the corner that is labelled without Christ I’m nothing incase of anything.

                      Like

                    • makagutu says:

                      I think we need to be fair, I didn’t reject Christ, he was never there in the first place. I rejected the stories which have now been turned into reality by Johnny come lately.

                      Like

                    • Oh, it’s okay if you wanna put it that way too.It still remains,you left Christianity and not many people get that chance,they are instead trapped in, actually by choice so you don’t need to worry about everyone. Oh it also still stands that if Christ was a folk tale or a made up story, I would be honest enough to tell you so but I know otherwise. But like you, I had an opportunity to reject false tales and be realistic, so if I’m choosing Christ now,it’s an honest decision and a very smart one too. But you don’t know me so you really can’t tell whether I’m just being a hypocrite really .

                      Like

                    • Nan says:

                      Oh my! I can’t help but ask! When you write: but I know otherwise as related to whether or not the stories about Christ are folk tales or made up stories … HOW do you know?

                      In essence … you can’t know otherwise. It’s simply what you CHOOSE to believe.

                      Like

                    • 🤣🤣 I know. It ain’t just what I choose to believe. But like I said some good time back, I ain’t engaging in any arguments or discussions. We all need to move on . I guess you moved on too after leaving Christianity, I mean sometimes when I’m talking to people who left Christianity, I just feel like instead of letting go and moving on with their lives, they are kinda staying back and claiming that the only reason is educating others about the follies of Christianity.

                      Like

                    • makagutu says:

                      Exactly.

                      Liked by 1 person

                    • makagutu says:

                      I have not suggested you are a hypocrite. But as far as I can tell, I don’t think you have a special revelation about Jesus other than what you were taught as a baby and has been reinforced over the years. It is really not knowledge but faith.

                      Like

                    • That’s your say, not mine. I mean like some of you guys I chose to leave the Church. But if I didn’t have a special revelation, I would have stayed in Church and stayed away from God and God talk , ironic but true. I only suggested you thinking me a hypocrite because you don’t really know me, how can you tell whether I’m a liar or not. I mean you are free to conclude that I’m just a foolish fellow who can’t think critically like Gary and even then, it would be okay. But why waste time, you have gotten a way of explaining away the truth I mean that’s because you know alot already, so like Nan,you can explain everything away. Discussing this won’t get you anywhere really. And I have kinda just told Nan I won’t be saying anything and I’m doing it again ,oh gosh

                      Like

                    • makagutu says:

                      Talk is good but you need not throw aspersions. I haven’t said I know everything. So that would be a case of you accusing me falsely while on my part I have tried to remain quite civil with you.

                      Like

                    • Okay, sorry for the judgment and conclusions I made about you. Sorry. Good day.😃

                      Like

                    • Oh but somehow, I don’t know if you guys noticed this, but I think Church is the best place to Reject God, in there you never really face Him or the truth, you just gladly reject him and people never even know you have done that. My former Church was the best, you could be a Christian without Christ, A servant of God but God was never in that picture.

                      Like

                    • makagutu says:

                      This is new. I didn’t know this.

                      Like

                    • Oh it’s the reason I think people who leave Church and Christianity are more noble even though they just may have to face more hatred or criticism from church goers. I mean sometimes it’s just the honest decision to make.

                      Like

  4. Surely , Nan ,you should have moved on,really. I mean you don’t want me repeating a series of stuff you will either not understand,misunderstand or reject kindly. In Christianity, never looking back is kinda important, you make no reserves , and I guess you did too when you left Christianity so why the questions? Like I once said,the Christians you may claim to wanna help are either people who no Christ so they can never look back or people who don’t know and know he might be a folk tale but they are not trapped like you might think,they rather love the comforts of a pretentious Sunday in most cases .

    Like

    • Sorry I meant KNOW CHRIST, not no Christ

      Like

    • Nan says:

      Emily, if you would stop making statements on Mak’s blog that can so easily be refuted related to your desire to “share Christ,” then I will stop responding.

      Further, you need to consider that Mak’s blog is NOT Christian-oriented, so you are bound to get kick-back. Perhaps it is YOU that needs to “move on.”

      Liked by 1 person

      • But Im not sharing Christ on Mak’s blog, last time I checked, I was saying I won’t be saying anything, anyway I guess I’m still replying to comments and that’s not leaving ,sorry .But I moved on sometime back,do you see me and Mak discussing Christ stuff. Okay I promise not to reply to any more comments, sorry .

        Like

We sure would love to hear your comments, compliments and thoughts.

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out /  Change )

Google photo

You are commenting using your Google account. Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out /  Change )

Connecting to %s