why i don’t support marriage

No, that’s click-bait. Local man is unable to can so we will all make do with this post, for now.

But it is a response to why I don’t support same sex marriage, as if one cares for your opinion.

Dear reader, you have heard the claim

since God is love, he must surely approve of any kind of human love, including SSM.?

Did you know that

This argument fails on two accounts.?

I am sure you did not know. We are told

Firstly, nobody approves of “all kinds” of love. If I’m married to woman A, I’m not allowed to also marry woman B; and if woman B is already married, I can’t marry her even if I’m single myself. And if she is actually an under-age girl, any attempt to woo her will rightly land me in prison!

which is a fallacious argument. We don’t marry all those we love. I love my father, but I am not about to marry him. And there are people who have gotten married without love. So it is possible to approve “all kinds” of love, without marrying the people loved.

In the second argument we are told

Secondly, when we talk about God’s love, we’re not talking about romantic love. It’s quite a serious category mistake to equate God’s holy, self-sacrificial love, driven by a desire to set us free from sin and death and bring us back into his Kingdom, with our fickle human love which depends so much on feelings and selfish desires!

This preceding argument is wrought with many problems. First among them, we don’t know which god is being referred to here. There is Cupid/Eros gods of love and desire. And as far as I can tell, it is desire for romantic love not some abstract love. The second problem with this argument is many theologians have told us we cannot know the mind nor the nature of god and therefore we are not in a position to comment on what god loves or does not. We have no idea of any other love other than that which we express in human language.

The pastor writes

it’s never OK to disagree with the Word of God. We may sometimes find we have misunderstood the Bible, and therefore have to change our belief based on this improved understanding – but we’re never at liberty to simply disregard what God has said!

which means, it is not the bible that is wrong for example in commanding that you shall not suffer a witch to live or that you can beat up your slave as long as they don’t die the same day, but that it is us who have misunderstood the word of god. If you are not stoning your wives for wearing mixed garments, you are disregarding the word of god and hell awaits you.

Now, to the ridiculous

It seems fairly obvious that before Adam sinned, slavery wasn’t a thing; and in eternity, slavery will no longer be a thing. So it’s perfectly logical for the church to oppose slavery: the Bible is clearly pointing that way itself.

which is saying nothing really. For fucks sake, how many days were there between Adam being created an idiot and him eating the apple? How many people were there to be enslaved? The bible was used by those pro and anti slavery to bolster their positions. There is no clear command in the bible that says, fuckers, thou shall keep no slaves.

The pastor continues

The same goes for gender discrimination. Even though it’s always been an aspect of sinful human society, and Paul gives guidelines for how that should play out in the Christian community, it’s fairly clear that originally, the only difference was biological.

and ffs, how is this any less problematic? In fact, the way women are disregarded in the bible is not just seen in Paul’s writing but throughout. Most women have no names. I’ll wait for who will tell me the name of Lot’s wife or Potiphar’s wife. I am waiting.

We are told, for those who may have been unaware, that while the bible makes allowances for patriarchy and slavery and while moving towards abolishing them, the same cannot be said for homosexuality. He says

The Bible makes cultural allowances for divorce and polygamy (again: allowing, not approving!), but the movement is clearly back towards the starting point: life-long monogamous heterosexual marriage.

If Paul is to be believed, the movement is towards celibacy, which must have been the original idea in the first creation stories where Adam was created alone. Or maybe he was to be intimate with goats and lions because shortly later, we find warnings to not sleep with goats.

If the pastor wants to have this

I think we can justifiably assume that when Jesus condemns “immoralities” in Mark 7:21 (the Greek word is plural), this would have included everything OT Law considered immoral, including homosexuality.

the question is, why stop at homosexuality or same sex marriage? Are there greater or lesser sins? And how are they weighted? I know the only sin the authors of the NT thought weighed many kilograms was sin against the spirit (Mark 3:28–29, Matthew 12:31–32, and Luke 12:10). In fact, if the pastor is treating homosexuality as a sin, then it is forgivable.

The pastor concludes with love the sinner, but condemn the sin. In his words

obviously homosexuals can be followers of Jesus. Rejecting SSM must never mean that we reject those who experience same-sex attraction. Everyone is welcome in the Kingdom of God, regardless of their flaws and weaknesses; after all, we’re all weak and sinful and in need of the forgiveness and restoration only Jesus provides.

which always leaves me asking why would women still be in church? And why would any gay person remain a member of a church who sees them as living in sin?

Well, anyone who wants to marry, by all means, marry. Anyone who doesn’t want to, should not. And anyone who is not sure, maybe should get married and if they don’t like it, leave it.

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Equal rights for all

This is a response to Caroline’s post , equal rights for adulterers, where one would think she is arguing against adultery but it is her attempt attacking those arguing for the equal rights of LGBTs to marry.

Before we get to Caroline, let us define our terms, shall we?

(1): the state of being united to a person of the opposite sex as husband or wife in a consensual and contractual relationship recognized by law (2): the state of being united to a person of the same-sex in a relationship like that of a traditional marriage b: the mutual relation of married persons ;
c: the institution whereby individuals are joined in a marriage
: an act of marrying or the rite by which the married status is effected; especially: the wedding ceremony and attendant festivities or formalities
: an intimate or close union
Having defined our terms, please allow me to define traditional marriage then we will look at Caroline’s problem with the LGBTs in this light.

Let us hear what Caroline is telling her audience

The argument for same-sex marriage says that denying that right to gays is discriminatory and unfair. No…it’s not. No more than denying the right to have multiple spouses, have sex with a ten-year old, or marry your mother. Equal worth does not mandate equal opportunities.

How she sees that this isn’t discriminatory I don’t get. She is referring to a slippery slope that doesn’t even exist. I have got news for Caroline, one no one in their right mind is going to marry their mothers, no body wants to have sex with 10 year olds and you really must be naive to think that to grant a gay couple the right to marry will lead to any of the things you mention. With the rate of divorce across the board, many people marry several spouses in one lifetime that at the end it really makes no much difference.

No one is trying to stop gays from setting up house together. But redefining marriage should absolutely be off the table.

Did you look at the definitions I gave [they were from MW dictionary] so who is trying to redefine marriage? I bet it is Caroline who want marriage to be defined in Christian terms as if marriage is only a christian affair!

I believe the primary reason is that only then will they feel that their lifestyle has legitimacy and acceptance.

You got it all wrong. This is a bigoted stand and you know it. How is their marriage going to affect yours?

But legitimizing homosexuality by redefining marriage will inevitably result in my right to religious freedom being infringed on, as I will be forced to condone (or at least not oppose) and help support a lifestyle that I believe is a sin. Just as normalizing and destigmatizing polygamy would. I am NOT saying I’m less of a sinner than your average, law-abiding homosexual. I AM saying that redefining marriage and sin is like introducing an indestructible killer virus into society.

Now this got to me seriously! Her religious freedom my foot! Is she being asked to be gay? Well Caroline you will have to show us that your god exists and that your religious claims have a truth value before you can tell us of your religious freedom. A sin is an offense against god and it is this god Caroline and her ilk her failed to define to existence. How can she then claim this god will be offended? Caroline and your ilk, first ensure there are no divorces in your traditional marriage then and only then can you start talking about other people’s lives. And while you are at it, please tell me when you chose to be heterosexual, this information will help many generations in the future.

Am guessing Caroline is a citizen of the US of A and this is what the constitution says about religion

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

I will say here that am not versed in law, but please tell me where in the above it says gays shall not be allowed to get married because it is this clause that deals with religious freedom? I am aware there is a petition before the SCOTUS on marriage. Here, here and here are some articles on what has been going on in the court and for a person like Caroline to argue as she does is to pretend ignorance of the facts.

Are you ready for same-sex marriage to be forced on you? Are you okay with sharing your spouse?

How many people have been forced to drink alcohol since it was made legal? How many people are forced to smoke because smoking is legal? Last time I checked no one was forcing anything on anyone and unless Caroline can support this claim it would be fair to consider her a bigot.

Polygamy is almost certainly next in line to be demanded as a human right. What defense would we have for prohibiting it once the traditional family unit is debased?

Don’t worry, just ask your husband not to love another woman and if he does, divorce him.